Talk:Weapons - Revision history

Jasonred at 12:21, 8 April 2009

2009-04-08T12:21:59Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:21, 8 April 2009
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	I've seen different numbers for TU usage for melee attacks (Possibly because when I was testing on different skill levels, it took either 14 or 15 TU. Variation like that would indicate integer rounding is to blame and that usually happens when you are calculating cost based on a percentage). So that's why I'm starting to think it's a % cost. Not sure though. Needs testing too. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 17:59, 19 December 2008 (CST)		I've seen different numbers for TU usage for melee attacks (Possibly because when I was testing on different skill levels, it took either 14 or 15 TU. Variation like that would indicate integer rounding is to blame and that usually happens when you are calculating cost based on a percentage). So that's why I'm starting to think it's a % cost. Not sure though. Needs testing too. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 17:59, 19 December 2008 (CST)


			: This is a pretty out of date discussion, you guys want to hold onto it for posterity of delete it? Anyhow, have all the mysteries of Chryssalid attack damage been revealed? I think so, right?

			: Does the Xcom "HIT" attack do melee damage? [[User:Jasonred\|Jasonred]] 08:21, 8 April 2009 (EDT)

Seb76: /* Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee */

2008-12-20T14:47:59Z

Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee

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 I'll give it a shot. Do you happen to know where the integrated weapon stats for the aliens are located (like %usage, damage, ammo for the turret etc)? That would save me a whole bunch of time. --[[User:Zombie|Zombie]] 15:10, 19 December 2008 (CST)
 ::I thought the Chryssalid used 15 TUs flat for melee, along with the other melee aliens...?  [[User:Arrow Quivershaft|Arrow Quivershaft]] 17:49, 19 December 2008 (CST)
 I've seen different numbers for TU usage for melee attacks (Possibly because when I was testing on different skill levels, it took either 14 or 15 TU. Variation like that would indicate integer rounding is to blame and that usually happens when you are calculating cost based on a percentage). So that's why I'm starting to think it's a % cost. Not sure though. Needs testing too. --[[User:Zombie|Zombie]] 17:59, 19 December 2008 (CST)

Zombie: /* Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee */ TU Cost for Melee.

2008-12-19T23:59:44Z

Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee: TU Cost for Melee.

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:59, 19 December 2008
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	::I thought the Chryssalid used 15 TUs flat for melee, along with the other melee aliens...? [[User:Arrow Quivershaft\|Arrow Quivershaft]] 17:49, 19 December 2008 (CST)		::I thought the Chryssalid used 15 TUs flat for melee, along with the other melee aliens...? [[User:Arrow Quivershaft\|Arrow Quivershaft]] 17:49, 19 December 2008 (CST)

			I've seen different numbers for TU usage for melee attacks (Possibly because when I was testing on different skill levels, it took either 14 or 15 TU. Variation like that would indicate integer rounding is to blame and that usually happens when you are calculating cost based on a percentage). So that's why I'm starting to think it's a % cost. Not sure though. Needs testing too. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 17:59, 19 December 2008 (CST)

Arrow Quivershaft: /* Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee */ TU usage for melee?

2008-12-19T23:49:08Z

Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee: TU usage for melee?

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:49, 19 December 2008
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	I'll give it a shot. Do you happen to know where the integrated weapon stats for the aliens are located (like %usage, damage, ammo for the turret etc)? That would save me a whole bunch of time. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 15:10, 19 December 2008 (CST)		I'll give it a shot. Do you happen to know where the integrated weapon stats for the aliens are located (like %usage, damage, ammo for the turret etc)? That would save me a whole bunch of time. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 15:10, 19 December 2008 (CST)

			::I thought the Chryssalid used 15 TUs flat for melee, along with the other melee aliens...? [[User:Arrow Quivershaft\|Arrow Quivershaft]] 17:49, 19 December 2008 (CST)

Zombie: /* Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee */ Response to Seb

2008-12-19T21:10:09Z

Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee: Response to Seb

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:10, 19 December 2008
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	.text:004065BF 66 C7 05 CE 7B 47 00 00 00 mov word_477BCE, 0		.text:004065BF 66 C7 05 CE 7B 47 00 00 00 mov word_477BCE, 0
	:If the chryssi can kill your guys, then we'll know that it can do melee damage... HTH [[User:Seb76\|Seb76]] 14:56, 19 December 2008 (CST)		:If the chryssi can kill your guys, then we'll know that it can do melee damage... HTH [[User:Seb76\|Seb76]] 14:56, 19 December 2008 (CST)

			I'll give it a shot. Do you happen to know where the integrated weapon stats for the aliens are located (like %usage, damage, ammo for the turret etc)? That would save me a whole bunch of time. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 15:10, 19 December 2008 (CST)

Seb76: /* Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee */

2008-12-19T20:56:14Z

Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:56, 19 December 2008
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	Even with Health and Armour patched very high, the Zombification Experiment against humans will be harder to interpret due to the high attack rate of the Chryssalid, unless there is a way to patch the TU% of its built-in attack to 55%. Good luck Zombie![[User:Spike\|Spike]] 12:30, 19 December 2008 (CST)		Even with Health and Armour patched very high, the Zombification Experiment against humans will be harder to interpret due to the high attack rate of the Chryssalid, unless there is a way to patch the TU% of its built-in attack to 55%. Good luck Zombie![[User:Spike\|Spike]] 12:30, 19 December 2008 (CST)

			:In case it case help, I think you can disable zombification by patching:
			.text:004065BF 66 C7 05 CE 7B 47 00 01 00 mov word_477BCE, 1
			:into
			.text:004065BF 66 C7 05 CE 7B 47 00 00 00 mov word_477BCE, 0
			:If the chryssi can kill your guys, then we'll know that it can do melee damage... HTH [[User:Seb76\|Seb76]] 14:56, 19 December 2008 (CST)

Spike: Experimental challenges of Zombification

2008-12-19T18:30:05Z

Experimental challenges of Zombification

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:30, 19 December 2008
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	:Just remember that this theory is only for tanks and hence, no zombification (I always love using this word), just death. Humans on the other hand, are different. I think I can set up a testing scenario much like the tank to see if soldiers actually take damage before getting zombified (another word I like too). At least for the tanks, armor is the most important attribute to keep Chryssalids at bay. The crap armor of the land-based tanks really don't offer much protection though. One or two pokes and that's it. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 11:04, 19 December 2008 (CST)		:Just remember that this theory is only for tanks and hence, no zombification (I always love using this word), just death. Humans on the other hand, are different. I think I can set up a testing scenario much like the tank to see if soldiers actually take damage before getting zombified (another word I like too). At least for the tanks, armor is the most important attribute to keep Chryssalids at bay. The crap armor of the land-based tanks really don't offer much protection though. One or two pokes and that's it. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 11:04, 19 December 2008 (CST)


			Even with Health and Armour patched very high, the Zombification Experiment against humans will be harder to interpret due to the high attack rate of the Chryssalid, unless there is a way to patch the TU% of its built-in attack to 55%. Good luck Zombie![[User:Spike\|Spike]] 12:30, 19 December 2008 (CST)

Zombie: /* Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee */ Note about tanks and humans.

2008-12-19T17:04:52Z

Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee: Note about tanks and humans.

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:04, 19 December 2008
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	Maybe it's "Zombification on any non-zero damage". That's what the [[Chryssalid#Zombification]] article seems to suggest. Given the high levels of HTH damage it would be hard to tell the difference in most cases. But Zombie's tests will soon reveal all! [[User:Spike\|Spike]] 10:02, 19 December 2008 (CST)		Maybe it's "Zombification on any non-zero damage". That's what the [[Chryssalid#Zombification]] article seems to suggest. Given the high levels of HTH damage it would be hard to tell the difference in most cases. But Zombie's tests will soon reveal all! [[User:Spike\|Spike]] 10:02, 19 December 2008 (CST)

			:Just remember that this theory is only for tanks and hence, no zombification (I always love using this word), just death. Humans on the other hand, are different. I think I can set up a testing scenario much like the tank to see if soldiers actually take damage before getting zombified (another word I like too). At least for the tanks, armor is the most important attribute to keep Chryssalids at bay. The crap armor of the land-based tanks really don't offer much protection though. One or two pokes and that's it. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 11:04, 19 December 2008 (CST)

Spike: /* Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee */ or Damage > 0 = Zombie ?

2008-12-19T16:02:03Z

Chryssalids Technically Do Not Use Melee: or Damage > 0 = Zombie ?

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:02, 19 December 2008
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	:I think that "Zombification on 0HP" theory works. It might be a slight bit easier to code than a rule exception, and if the Chryssalid can throw damage out in excess of 250 points an attack, then the exception really isn't needed, anyways. [[User:Arrow Quivershaft\|Arrow Quivershaft]] 09:07, 19 December 2008 (CST)		:I think that "Zombification on 0HP" theory works. It might be a slight bit easier to code than a rule exception, and if the Chryssalid can throw damage out in excess of 250 points an attack, then the exception really isn't needed, anyways. [[User:Arrow Quivershaft\|Arrow Quivershaft]] 09:07, 19 December 2008 (CST)

			Maybe it's "Zombification on any non-zero damage". That's what the [[Chryssalid#Zombification]] article seems to suggest. Given the high levels of HTH damage it would be hard to tell the difference in most cases. But Zombie's tests will soon reveal all! [[User:Spike\|Spike]] 10:02, 19 December 2008 (CST)

Arrow Quivershaft: Massive melee damage with zombification at 0HP makes sense here.

2008-12-19T15:07:04Z

Massive melee damage with zombification at 0HP makes sense here.

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:07, 19 December 2008
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	Ok, I edited the tank so that it had 1 health unit and no armor, then ventured into the executable and edited the tank's damage modifier to melee damage from 90% to 0%. Then I went back into the mission and let the Chryssalid loose. It proceeded to try to kill the tank, but nothing happened. So it should be safe to say the Chryssalid's attack is melee-based. Perhaps what is happening is that a unit doesn't get turned into a Zombie unless health reaches 0 with melee attack from the Chryssalid. So I'll take back my objection. I don't have much time right now, but when I do, I'll set up an automated testing scenario with Bomb Bloke's logger and AutoHotKey to check out how much damage the Chryssalid (as well as the other melee-based terrorists) really can cause. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 23:03, 18 December 2008 (CST)		Ok, I edited the tank so that it had 1 health unit and no armor, then ventured into the executable and edited the tank's damage modifier to melee damage from 90% to 0%. Then I went back into the mission and let the Chryssalid loose. It proceeded to try to kill the tank, but nothing happened. So it should be safe to say the Chryssalid's attack is melee-based. Perhaps what is happening is that a unit doesn't get turned into a Zombie unless health reaches 0 with melee attack from the Chryssalid. So I'll take back my objection. I don't have much time right now, but when I do, I'll set up an automated testing scenario with Bomb Bloke's logger and AutoHotKey to check out how much damage the Chryssalid (as well as the other melee-based terrorists) really can cause. --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 23:03, 18 December 2008 (CST)

			:I think that "Zombification on 0HP" theory works. It might be a slight bit easier to code than a rule exception, and if the Chryssalid can throw damage out in excess of 250 points an attack, then the exception really isn't needed, anyways. [[User:Arrow Quivershaft\|Arrow Quivershaft]] 09:07, 19 December 2008 (CST)