Talk:Morale - Revision history

Magic9mushroom: /* "Beserk" */ new section

2014-08-13T09:35:33Z

"Beserk": new section

← Older revision		Revision as of 09:35, 13 August 2014
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	Something worthy to note: I was wondering, what is the morale effect of killing a civilian? From the looks of it, aliens gain and soldiers lose morale. However, killing a civilian isn't counted as friendly fire: only that soldier loses morale, not the team. I noticed this when a rocket aimed at a Chryssalid killed a civilian standing nearby (the chryssie survived), then confirmed this when a stray shot took out another (it was an auto shot, with the third one dealing the killing blow and the second killing a Snakeman). See the second example? When the snakeman died, the soldier was at 100 morale so it had no effect. When the civilian died however, he lost 10 morale but others were unaffected. --[[User:Amitakartok\|amitakartok]] 16:17, 14 November 2008 (CST)		Something worthy to note: I was wondering, what is the morale effect of killing a civilian? From the looks of it, aliens gain and soldiers lose morale. However, killing a civilian isn't counted as friendly fire: only that soldier loses morale, not the team. I noticed this when a rocket aimed at a Chryssalid killed a civilian standing nearby (the chryssie survived), then confirmed this when a stray shot took out another (it was an auto shot, with the third one dealing the killing blow and the second killing a Snakeman). See the second example? When the snakeman died, the soldier was at 100 morale so it had no effect. When the civilian died however, he lost 10 morale but others were unaffected. --[[User:Amitakartok\|amitakartok]] 16:17, 14 November 2008 (CST)

			== "Beserk" ==

			The typo should probably be mentioned somewhere in the main article (or under "berserk"), in case somebody with bad English skills comes on here and wonders why we're all talking about the unknown (to him) "berserk" when he's looking for what "gone Beserk" means. [[User:Magic9mushroom\|Magic9mushroom]] ([[User talk:Magic9mushroom\|talk]]) 05:35, 13 August 2014 (EDT)

Bomb Bloke: /* Hello :) */

2011-03-19T01:48:59Z

Hello :)

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:48, 19 March 2011
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	:Assuming I AM right, 1 + randmod(2) only provides a range of 1 to 2, whereas in practise, the values that get passed to [[UNITREF.DAT#60\|UnitRef[60]]] are in the range of 1 to 3... - <span style="font-size:xx-small"> [[User:Bomb_Bloke\|Bomb Bloke]] ([[User_talk:Bomb_Bloke\|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Bomb_Bloke\|Contribs]])</span> 21:40, 18 March 2011 (EDT)		:Assuming I AM right, 1 + randmod(2) only provides a range of 1 to 2, whereas in practise, the values that get passed to [[UNITREF.DAT#60\|UnitRef[60]]] are in the range of 1 to 3... - <span style="font-size:xx-small"> [[User:Bomb_Bloke\|Bomb Bloke]] ([[User_talk:Bomb_Bloke\|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Bomb_Bloke\|Contribs]])</span> 21:40, 18 March 2011 (EDT)

			::Scratch all that, I see on the Experience talk page you're taking the modulus a the parameter + 1, which avoids division by 0 errors and provides the full range. All clear to me now. - <span style="font-size:xx-small"> [[User:Bomb_Bloke\|Bomb Bloke]] ([[User_talk:Bomb_Bloke\|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Bomb_Bloke\|Contribs]])</span> 21:48, 18 March 2011 (EDT)

	== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==		== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==

Bomb Bloke: /* Hello :) */

2011-03-19T01:40:30Z

Hello :)

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:40, 19 March 2011
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	--[[User:Volutar\|Volutar]] 12:38, 14 March 2011 (EDT)		--[[User:Volutar\|Volutar]] 12:38, 14 March 2011 (EDT)

			:I've been scratching my head a little over this, thinking my understanding to be wrong; but I think maybe you really did mean randmod(3) instead of randmod(2)?

			:Assuming I AM right, 1 + randmod(2) only provides a range of 1 to 2, whereas in practise, the values that get passed to [[UNITREF.DAT#60\|UnitRef[60]]] are in the range of 1 to 3... - <span style="font-size:xx-small"> [[User:Bomb_Bloke\|Bomb Bloke]] ([[User_talk:Bomb_Bloke\|Talk]]/[[Special:Contributions/Bomb_Bloke\|Contribs]])</span> 21:40, 18 March 2011 (EDT)

	== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==		== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==

Volutar: fear resisting or panic formula

2011-03-14T16:38:31Z

fear resisting or panic formula

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:38, 14 March 2011
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	:::MTR: Here's your info on it: [[Talk:Bravery]]. Hope it helps! [[User:Arrow Quivershaft\|Arrow Quivershaft]] 08:03, 1 June 2008 (PDT)		:::MTR: Here's your info on it: [[Talk:Bravery]]. Hope it helps! [[User:Arrow Quivershaft\|Arrow Quivershaft]] 08:03, 1 June 2008 (PDT)

			== Hello :) ==

			Formula of choosing if unit gets bravery experience points or panic is simple:

			if (UnitRef->Morale < 50)
			{
			if (UnitRef->Morale >= randmod(50))
			++UnitRef->Bravery_experience;
			else
			UnitRef->PanicMode = 1 + randmod(2);
			}

			--[[User:Volutar\|Volutar]] 12:38, 14 March 2011 (EDT)

	== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==		== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==

Amitakartok at 22:17, 14 November 2008

2008-11-14T22:17:45Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:17, 14 November 2008
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	== Hobbes' morale info at xcomufo==		== Hobbes' morale info at xcomufo==
	Ethereal Cereal: Hobbes' topic on morale still exists. You just have to be logged in there to view it. Anyway, I agree with your change. :) --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 20:34, 4 May 2008 (PDT)		Ethereal Cereal: Hobbes' topic on morale still exists. You just have to be logged in there to view it. Anyway, I agree with your change. :) --[[User:Zombie\|Zombie]] 20:34, 4 May 2008 (PDT)

			----

			Something worthy to note: I was wondering, what is the morale effect of killing a civilian? From the looks of it, aliens gain and soldiers lose morale. However, killing a civilian isn't counted as friendly fire: only that soldier loses morale, not the team. I noticed this when a rocket aimed at a Chryssalid killed a civilian standing nearby (the chryssie survived), then confirmed this when a stray shot took out another (it was an auto shot, with the third one dealing the killing blow and the second killing a Snakeman). See the second example? When the snakeman died, the soldier was at 100 morale so it had no effect. When the civilian died however, he lost 10 morale but others were unaffected. --[[User:Amitakartok\|amitakartok]] 16:17, 14 November 2008 (CST)

Arrow Quivershaft: Searchmaster Arrow to the rescue!

2008-06-01T15:03:19Z

Searchmaster Arrow to the rescue!

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:03, 1 June 2008
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	:There is no rounding issue with random number generation. The games uses an [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_congruential_generator LCG] (I posted it somewhere already IIRC) modulo'ed. Also I checked and found only one place where offset 0x3C is modified (except for zombification/chryssalidation and unit creation of course). I'm positive it is one third for each possible panic action. I remember you posted something about strange running patterns; that may be why I posted the info in the first place ;-) [[User:Seb76\|Seb76]] 02:27, 31 May 2008 (PDT)		:There is no rounding issue with random number generation. The games uses an [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_congruential_generator LCG] (I posted it somewhere already IIRC) modulo'ed. Also I checked and found only one place where offset 0x3C is modified (except for zombification/chryssalidation and unit creation of course). I'm positive it is one third for each possible panic action. I remember you posted something about strange running patterns; that may be why I posted the info in the first place ;-) [[User:Seb76\|Seb76]] 02:27, 31 May 2008 (PDT)

			:::MTR: Here's your info on it: [[Talk:Bravery]]. Hope it helps! [[User:Arrow Quivershaft\|Arrow Quivershaft]] 08:03, 1 June 2008 (PDT)

	== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==		== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==

Seb76 at 09:27, 31 May 2008

2008-05-31T09:27:13Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 09:27, 31 May 2008
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	::One other thought: The ultra-careful X-COM player should approach enemies from the southeast. ;) -[[User:MikeTheRed\|MikeTheRed]] 22:02, 30 May 2008 (PDT)		::One other thought: The ultra-careful X-COM player should approach enemies from the southeast. ;) -[[User:MikeTheRed\|MikeTheRed]] 22:02, 30 May 2008 (PDT)

			:There is no rounding issue with random number generation. The games uses an [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_congruential_generator LCG] (I posted it somewhere already IIRC) modulo'ed. Also I checked and found only one place where offset 0x3C is modified (except for zombification/chryssalidation and unit creation of course). I'm positive it is one third for each possible panic action. I remember you posted something about strange running patterns; that may be why I posted the info in the first place ;-) [[User:Seb76\|Seb76]] 02:27, 31 May 2008 (PDT)

	== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==		== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==

MikeTheRed at 05:08, 31 May 2008

2008-05-31T05:08:07Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:08, 31 May 2008
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	::Great work. I'm pretty convinced it's not an exact third - see [[Berserk]]. 1688 individuals' data is not a small sample; it should be good to the third decimal place, roughly. It's easy to imagine the programmers had rounding errors that made real game results be 34% berserk, 33% panic, 33% freeze, or whatever, shrug. This level of rounding imprecision doesn't impact the overall game, so they rightly should not have worried about it. You've located some relevant bytes - and well done there - but I daresay we are not yet at the point of isolating all possible parts of code involved, including rounding errors. Still, it's very cool to see someone digging out the actual programming code. All the rest of us have otherwise looked at data files, or done in-game testing.		::Great work. I'm pretty convinced it's not an exact third - see [[Berserk]]. 1688 individuals' data is not a small sample; it should be good to the third decimal place, roughly. It's easy to imagine the programmers had rounding errors that made real game results be 34% berserk, 33% panic, 33% freeze, or whatever, shrug. This level of rounding imprecision doesn't impact the overall game, so they rightly should not have worried about it. You've located some relevant bytes - and well done there - but I daresay we are not yet at the point of isolating all possible parts of code involved, including rounding errors. Still, it's very cool to see someone digging out the actual programming code. All the rest of us have otherwise looked at data files, or done in-game testing.

	::When I did the Berserk testing, I definitely always saw everyone that panicked, running to the southeast. I could swear I wrote it down on the wiki somewhere, but can't find it now. Anyway, they always did. In fact I tried making a wall of soldiers to prevent them from being able to run southeast, and guess what: They ran right through them, a physical impossibility. ~~-[[User:MikeTheRed\|MikeTheRed]] 22:02, 30 May 2008 (PDT)~~		::When I did the Berserk testing, I definitely always saw everyone that panicked, running to the southeast. I could swear I wrote it down on the wiki somewhere, but can't find it now. Anyway, they always did. In fact I tried making a wall of soldiers to prevent them from being able to run southeast, and guess what: They ran right through them, a physical impossibility.

	----		::One other thought: The ultra-careful X-COM player should approach enemies from the southeast. ;) -[[User:MikeTheRed\|MikeTheRed]] 22:02, 30 May 2008 (PDT)


			== Newer discussion above, older stuff below ==

	I hope you don't mind I moved your open question on the article page to here -- it'll probably remain unresolved for a while.		I hope you don't mind I moved your open question on the article page to here -- it'll probably remain unresolved for a while.

MikeTheRed at 05:02, 31 May 2008

2008-05-31T05:02:33Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:02, 31 May 2008
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	::You say a number from 0 to 15 can be added to the x/y co-ords, I assume that can also be subtracted? - [[User:Bomb Bloke\|Bomb Bloke]] 00:12, 26 May 2008 (PDT)		::You say a number from 0 to 15 can be added to the x/y co-ords, I assume that can also be subtracted? - [[User:Bomb Bloke\|Bomb Bloke]] 00:12, 26 May 2008 (PDT)
	:Well that's the catch, it is not the case so the unit should always run in the same quadran. [[User:Seb76\|Seb76]] 04:46, 26 May 2008 (PDT)		:Well that's the catch, it is not the case so the unit should always run in the same quadran. [[User:Seb76\|Seb76]] 04:46, 26 May 2008 (PDT)

			::Great work. I'm pretty convinced it's not an exact third - see [[Berserk]]. 1688 individuals' data is not a small sample; it should be good to the third decimal place, roughly. It's easy to imagine the programmers had rounding errors that made real game results be 34% berserk, 33% panic, 33% freeze, or whatever, shrug. This level of rounding imprecision doesn't impact the overall game, so they rightly should not have worried about it. You've located some relevant bytes - and well done there - but I daresay we are not yet at the point of isolating all possible parts of code involved, including rounding errors. Still, it's very cool to see someone digging out the actual programming code. All the rest of us have otherwise looked at data files, or done in-game testing.

			::When I did the Berserk testing, I definitely always saw everyone that panicked, running to the southeast. I could swear I wrote it down on the wiki somewhere, but can't find it now. Anyway, they always did. In fact I tried making a wall of soldiers to prevent them from being able to run southeast, and guess what: They ran right through them, a physical impossibility. -[[User:MikeTheRed\|MikeTheRed]] 22:02, 30 May 2008 (PDT)

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Seb76 at 11:46, 26 May 2008

2008-05-26T11:46:15Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:46, 26 May 2008
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	::You say a number from 0 to 15 can be added to the x/y co-ords, I assume that can also be subtracted? - [[User:Bomb Bloke\|Bomb Bloke]] 00:12, 26 May 2008 (PDT)		::You say a number from 0 to 15 can be added to the x/y co-ords, I assume that can also be subtracted? - [[User:Bomb Bloke\|Bomb Bloke]] 00:12, 26 May 2008 (PDT)
			:Well that's the catch, it is not the case so the unit should always run in the same quadran. [[User:Seb76\|Seb76]] 04:46, 26 May 2008 (PDT)

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